Digest for rec.sport.golf@googlegroups.com - 25 updates in 11 topics

Tuesday, May 16, 2017

BK@Onramp.net: May 16 09:39PM -0500

All FBI Docs on Trump and Comey, even Paul Ryan's spokeswoman says he
agrees.
Carbon <nobrac@nospam.tampabay.rr.com>: May 16 10:28PM -0400

On 05/16/2017 02:49 PM, -hh wrote:
> between the countries. Of course, these typically aren't releasable.
 
> But the common sense point still holds: you don't give away what's not
> yours to give.

I'm waiting for signs of common sense from the Republicans. I assume some
percentage of them are reasonable people who care about democracy.
 
Just this week Trump committed two impeachable offences: he tried to
coerce Comey into dropping the Russia investigation, and then he leaked
very sensitive information directly to the Russians.
 
It's not often I'm surprised by Trump's ineptitude. But this has truly
been a week for the ages.
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: May 16 05:45PM -0700

You're full of it, as usual. A lot of Democrats were very concerned
about HRC's use of a private e-mail server and about her sending
classified info therefrom. Most of us saw her as the lesser of two evils.
 
Trump knowingly and willfully gave SCI intelligence to agents of a
hostile foreign government that tried to sabotage the 2106 election.
He did so without the consent of the Israelis, from whom he had
gotten it. These are facts. It was an incredibly stupid thing to
do.
 
And this damages the Israelis how??
Are the Russians directly antagonistic toward Israel?
 
Mountain out of a mole hill
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 05:46PM -0700

On 2017-05-16 5:45 PM, Dene wrote:
> gotten it. These are facts. It was an incredibly stupid thing to
> do.
 
> And this damages the Israelis how??
 
You don't know.
 
I guess there was no need for the information to be classified at all!
 
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: May 16 06:03PM -0700

- show quoted text -
You're full of it, as usual. A lot of Democrats were very concerned
about HRC's use of a private e-mail server and about her sending
classified info therefrom. Most of us saw her as the lesser of two evils.
 
------
 
But not concerned enough to reject her nomination...
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 06:08PM -0700

On 2017-05-16 6:03 PM, Dene wrote:
> classified info therefrom. Most of us saw her as the lesser of two evils.
 
> ------
 
> But not concerned enough to reject her nomination...
 
Couldn't the same be said about the Republicans and their nomination of
the manifestly unfit Donald Trump?
 
:-)
BK@Onramp.net: May 16 08:55PM -0500

On Tue, 16 May 2017 16:24:50 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>
wrote:
 
>Plus it certainly wasn't a non-event.
 
>What I'm saying is much ado about nothing AND blatant hypocrisy. The Democrats have no concern that Hillary had classified information on an unsecured server. But....a vague reference to classified information from Trump is now a contrived uproar.
 
>Hope the crying wolf continues. Most Americans can see through this crap. The Democrats have no message except hate for Trump. It didn't work in November and it doesn't work now. The only thing that concerns me about this matter is the integrity of the one who leaks this nonsense.
 
Most Americans see through Trump and all he's fucked up to date except
for those who are blind to these facts.
 
Check his polls, all of them. He's being found out and I'm surprised
that you are so blind to it.
BK@Onramp.net: May 16 09:10PM -0500

On Tue, 16 May 2017 17:45:03 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>
wrote:
 
>gotten it. These are facts. It was an incredibly stupid thing to
>do.
 
>And this damages the Israelis how??
 
That would be the question Trump should have thought of.
It was secret you know, and that must have been important to the
Israelis. It was Trump the usual....a blabbermouth with no concept of
honor.
>Are the Russians directly antagonistic toward Israel?
 
>Mountain out of a mole hill.
You might want to tell the GOP that. As a matter of fact Senator John
Cornym the third ranking Republican from Texas was in line for the FBI
position. . He took his name out of consideration because he said he
would like to have the position under conditions unlike they are now.
Many of Congressional Republicans know it it's not a molehill. They're
now asking for an investigation into Trump regarding his asking Comey
to drop Russian investigation.
BK@Onramp.net: May 16 09:12PM -0500

On Tue, 16 May 2017 18:03:33 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>
wrote:
 
>classified info therefrom. Most of us saw her as the lesser of two evils.
 
>------
 
>But not concerned enough to reject her nomination...
 
Why don't you jump up to 2017? That's old news that wasn't
a national concern.
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 07:14PM -0700


>> But not concerned enough to reject her nomination...
 
> Why don't you jump up to 2017? That's old news that wasn't
> a national concern.
 
All he's got left is:
 
"But, but, but... Hillary! Obama!"
Carbon <nobrac@nospam.tampabay.rr.com>: May 16 10:14PM -0400

On 05/16/2017 12:29 PM, John B. wrote:
> exactly that. He gave it to representatives of an adversarial govt. w/o
> the consent of the allied govt. that had supplied it. And these bozos
> continue to defend the indefensible.
 
This isn't going to go on much longer. Say half the Republicans in
Congress and the Senate are capable of reason and therefore remorse.
That's all it's going to take. Trump will pull a Palin and quit once it
becomes obvious there are going to be consequences for his stupidity.
 
Trump's extensive business experience with his many bankruptcies will help
him judge the best time to cut and run.
Carbon <nobrac@nospam.tampabay.rr.com>: May 16 09:59PM -0400

On 05/16/2017 05:23 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
 
 
> <http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2017/PPP_Release_National_51617.pdf>
 
> Own it, wingnuts!
 
> :-)

Trump's con is collapsing even faster than I thought it would. He was able
to get away with being an idiot when he was a private citizen, but not
now. He's a done tom turkey.
BK@Onramp.net: May 16 08:49PM -0500

On Tue, 16 May 2017 18:13:15 -0500, David Laville
 
>I'm sorry you think pointing out your leftist hypocrisy makes me
>stupid.
 
>More proof liberalism is a mental disorder.
 
The two of you are incredible. Trump, who is not a liberal, is the
one who rolled back the school lunch program for children. John was
being sarcastic.
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 06:26PM -0700

You want to give Trump credit for the good: you've got to own the bad:
 
'U.S. share futures and the dollar slipped in early Asian trade on
Wednesday after reports that President Donald Trump asked then-FBI
Director James Comey to end a probe into his former security adviser.'
 
<http://www.reuters.com/article/us-global-markets-idUSKCN18D01B>
 
:-)
"Michael P" <MikePat@aol.com>: May 16 08:43PM -0400

So many amusing scenarios.
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 05:36PM -0700

...at any level?
 
'Donald Trump famously doesn't trust computers. At an event on New
Year's Eve, he told reporters, "You know, if you have something really
important, write it out and have it delivered by courier, the
old-fashioned way." Well, a pen and paper screwed him when his bodyguard
recently displayed the cellphone number of the Secretary of Defense for
all the world to see.'
 
<http://gizmodo.com/trumps-bodyguard-leaks-the-defense-secretarys-phone-num-1795277644>
Carbon <nobrac@nospam.tampabay.rr.com>: May 16 07:55PM -0400

On 05/16/2017 01:31 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
 
> <https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/15/opinion/trump-classified-data.html>
 
> A great piece.
 
> :-)
 
It would be funny if it wasn't so dangerous...
 
"Trump's statements don't necessarily come from anywhere, lead anywhere or
have a permanent reality beyond his wish to be liked at any given instant.
 
We've got this perverse situation in which the vast analytic powers of the
entire world are being spent trying to understand a guy whose thoughts are
often just six fireflies beeping randomly in a jar.
 
"We badly want to understand Trump, to grasp him," David Roberts writes in
Vox. "It might give us some sense of control, or at least an ability to
predict what he will do next. But what if there's nothing to understand?
What if there is no there there?"
 
And out of that void comes a carelessness that quite possibly betrayed an
intelligence source, and endangered a country.
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 05:03PM -0700

On 2017-05-16 4:55 PM, Carbon wrote:
> What if there is no there there?"
 
> And out of that void comes a carelessness that quite possibly betrayed an
> intelligence source, and endangered a country.
 
'Some U.S. officials have told Reuters they have been concerned about
disclosing highly classified intelligence to Trump.
 
One official, who requested anonymity to discuss dealing with the
president, said last month: "He has no filter; it's in one ear and out
the mouth."'
 
<http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-idUSKCN18B2MX?il=0>
"Welcome to Trumpton" <trumpton@maiIsorter.co.uk>: May 16 07:25PM

Alan Baker wrote:
 
> But he is concerned about how that information leaked out of the
> White House...
 
> ...THAT is critical!
 
Actually it is. He may have done no damage by sharing the data. The
world knowing he did it may have extremely serious consequences.
 
Leaks are a huge problem for an incompetent administration.
 
--
"Perception is often more important than reality"
Ivanka Trump (Family motto)
"Welcome to Trumpton" <trumpton@maiIsorter.co.uk>: May 16 07:37PM

Dene wrote:
 
 
> The president himself has since acknowledged he shared "facts" about
> the terror threat with Russia, while saying he was in his right to do
> so."
 
You do realise that none of that contradicts or answers the questions
raised. It fails to deny that highly classidifed data was shared.
 
McMaster himself refused to deny that highly classified data was shared
on more than one occasion.
 
At best it claims Trump was ignorant of the sensitivity of the data.
 
Ignorance seems to be a running theme with Trump.
Moderate <nospam@noemail.com>: May 16 02:56PM -0500

> between the countries. Of course, these typically aren't releasable.
 
> But the common sense point still holds: you don't give away what's not yours to give.
 
> -hh
 
Clearly your statement, "Period, full stop" was based on nothing.
--
Moderate <nospam@noemail.com>: May 16 02:58PM -0500


> You said that was "fake news".
 
> But it was true. McMaster now claims that it was "wholly appropriate",
> but that doesn't change the fact.
 
Go back and read the story.
--
Moderate <nospam@noemail.com>: May 16 03:43PM -0500


> It's clearly based on the fact that he has done jobs where he held
> security classifications.
 
> What have you got backing your statements, doofus?
 
His own words.
--
Moderate <nospam@noemail.com>: May 16 04:01PM -0500

The Secret Service confirmed someone climbed over the WH fence.
 
It is not clear whether they were going in or out.
--
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: May 16 01:30PM -0700

These guys are worth listening to:
 
'The Flagrant Foul in Trump's Disclosure of Classified Info to Russia:
The Missing Interagency Process
 
It was a far more effective strategy for the White House not to deny the
facts of the Washington Post report that the president had disclosed
information to Russia, but instead to claim that his decision to do so
was purposeful and appropriate. Indeed, like it or not, once the
president has decided not to view Russia as an adversary, but to embrace
Moscow as a potential partner and invite its officials into the Oval
Office, the sharing of information is likely to follow.
 
That said, why intelligence as sensitive as this? Why so gravely
compromise the vital relationship with the foreign ally who gave us the
intelligence? What was the cost-benefit analysis? What were the equities
for our intelligence agencies in revealing this information?
 
In my mind, the most vital question of all: Is it not the height of
recklessness for the president to make those calls on his own without
the information and advice he would receive from the interagency process?'
 
<https://www.justsecurity.org/41046/flagrant-foul-trumps-disclosure-classified-info-russia-missing-interagency-process/>
 
'Ryan Goodman (@rgoodlaw) is founding co-editor-in-chief of Just
Security. He is the Anne and Joel Ehrenkranz Professor of Law at New
York University School of Law. He served as Special Counsel to the
General Counsel of the Department of Defense (2015-16)'
 
<https://www.justsecurity.org/author/goodmanryan/>
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