Digest for alt.sports.football.pro.sf-49ers@googlegroups.com - 13 updates in 3 topics

Saturday, September 30, 2017

Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>: Sep 30 10:03AM -0600

On 9/29/2017 10:53 PM, John Walsh wrote:
 
> However, 49 percent of respondents think players should find a
> different way to express political opinions
 
> https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/poll-finds-84-percent-of-people-supports-nfl-players-right-to-protest/
 
Consider, is the US military not the most "inclusive" organization on
the face of this planet?
 
So why would these mouthy NFL children piss on their cornflakes through
OUR flag and Anthem?
 
Nuff said!
"cao" <cao_black@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 09:22AM -0700

"John Walsh" wrote in message
news:cm8usc1o4fqleserrfm61982mbr8m3mleh@4ax.com...
 
Poll finds 84 percent of people supports NFL players' right to protest
 
However, 49 percent of respondents think players should find a
different way to express political opinions
 
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/poll-finds-84-percent-of-people-supports-nfl-players-right-to-protest/
 
*****
 
1. CBS has more ties to the Obama admin than Florsheim
2. The poll contradicts itself (and most other polls).
3. Ask any one of those social warriors what they are "for" (while standing
in their driveway washing their modified Mercedes G wagon).
4. The owner's are just CYA. Supoort their players, but won't hire
Kaepernick. Go figure.
5. This is just anti-Trump bullshit, which would diminish, but not go away,
even if he STFU and stopped Tweeting (which he should do).
 
Crooked Hillary LOST...get over it. I will bet that all the critics who are
also parents would counsel their kids on why they should line up and hi-five
the other team after pee wee soccer (or why the winner runs to the net to
congratulate the loser at Wimbledon). But do they practice what they
preach? Ha!
 
Screw their polls. Just play football.
John Walsh <jwalsh589@gmail.com>: Sep 30 04:49PM -1000

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 10:03:07 -0600, Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>
wrote:
 
 
>So why would these mouthy NFL children piss on their cornflakes through
>OUR flag and Anthem?
 
>Nuff said!
 
This is a country founded on the concept of freedom of expression.
There is no special situation where that concept is abrogated. It's a
kind of a contradition when people complain about honoring the flag,
yet they wear it as clothing.
 
When you can say without lying that the military has big problems with
racism. I'll believe you about it being an inclusive oganization.
 
Mouthy children? Well, how about you step on the field and risk your
health to entertain the NFL fans? With the constant knowledge that
doing that one a weekly basis is might to leave you unable to name
your children or find your way home from the store after you retire.
 
Those are men, risking a lot to earn a living.
Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>: Sep 30 09:25PM -0600

On 9/30/2017 8:49 PM, John Walsh wrote:
>> OUR flag and Anthem?
 
>> Nuff said!
 
> This is a country founded on the concept of freedom of expression.
 
SFW?
 
> There is no special situation where that concept is abrogated.
 
Of course there is - it's called PRIVATE SECTOR employment, you MORON!
 
> It's a
> kind of a contradition when people complain about honoring the flag,
> yet they wear it as clothing.
 
Obfuscation and deflection.
 
> When you can say without lying that the military has big problems with
> racism. I'll believe you about it being an inclusive oganization.
 
WTF???
 
Are you INSANE?
 
The US military is the most inclusive organization on the face of God's
green earth!
 
You LYING TRAITOR!
 
 
> Mouthy children?
 
Lots, yes.
 
> Well, how about you step on the field and risk your
> health to entertain the NFL fans?
 
How about you join the military and put your very LIFE in peril for a
Hell of lot less than millions of dollar a year, you treasonous scumsucker!
 
> With the constant knowledge that
> doing that one a weekly basis is might to leave you unable to name
> your children or find your way home from the store after you retire.
 
Boo fucking hoo!
 
16-20 million$$ a year entitlement crybabies!
 
> Those are men, risking a lot to earn a living.
 
Their very LIVES?!????
 
Well "tall can" Walsh, do they risk their very LIVES th eminute they
sign a contract?
 
You miserable exterminable VERMIN!
"cao" <cao_black@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 09:15PM -0700

"John Walsh" wrote in message
news:mok0tc1gvnlmd8as2rb0gum866t06tukll@4ax.com...
 
On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 10:03:07 -0600, Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>
wrote:
 
 
>So why would these mouthy NFL children piss on their cornflakes through
>OUR flag and Anthem?
 
>Nuff said!
 
This is a country founded on the concept of freedom of expression.
There is no special situation where that concept is abrogated. It's a
kind of a contradition when people complain about honoring the flag,
yet they wear it as clothing.
 
 
******
 
Get a grip man. There are MANY instances where not just the concept but the
practice of freedom of expression is abrogated.
 
Try putting a nativity display on the steps of City Hall. Try telling the
judge he's a fucking idiot. Try telling snowflakes to live without "safe"
spaces, or allowing a conservative speech on most any college campus. Many
more examples exist (and you are smart enough to know this).
 
What about my rights as a ticket holder. I paid good money because I was
promised a certain form of entertainment. I was told nothing about being
subjected to social and political commentary. I want a refund...breach of
contract.
 
This is about the owner's being afraid of offending their cash cows (oh
shit...can I say that), and the well crafted anti-Trump movement. Real
linking of arms would try to find way to work together for EVERYONES
betterment. Good luck with that.
"Gary Rosen" <garymrosen@comcast.net>: Sep 30 12:49AM -0700

This isn't as surprising at it sounds. You don't have to be white
or a fervent Trump supporter just to want to be able to watch a
damn football game without being confronted by the divisive
politics of the day. It is mind-boggling that NFL owners could not
figure this out (as you said elsewhere in your post).
 
My 49er-centric take on this is that it's all the fault of the Yorks,
as usual. If Eddie had still owned the team, as soon as Kaep started
popping off he would have called him in and said,"You're here to
play football, not politics. Now cut the crap". And it would have
ended right there.
 
"a425couple" wrote in message news:oqjdai0e0j@news4.newsguy.com...
 
"Interestingly, there's little difference of opinion on the protests and
NFL viewing habits among whites, blacks and other minority adults," the
poll said.
poldy <poldy@kfu.com>: Sep 30 07:07PM -0700

On 9/30/17 12:49 AM, Gary Rosen wrote:
 
> "Interestingly, there's little difference of opinion on the protests and
> NFL viewing habits among whites, blacks and other minority adults," the
> poll said.
 
His was a pretty passive protest.
 
He didn't feel like going along with business as usual by standing for
the anthem.
 
He's not getting in people's face with signs or anything like that.
 
Sure the NFL could try to suppress that. But it would stand apart from
the NBA and other sports for suppressing speech.
John Walsh <jwalsh589@gmail.com>: Sep 30 04:29PM -1000

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 00:49:18 -0700, "Gary Rosen"
 
>"Interestingly, there's little difference of opinion on the protests and
>NFL viewing habits among whites, blacks and other minority adults," the
>poll said.
 
Is there a poll that says that 1/3 of the fans are less likely to
watch NFL games due to anthem protests? Watch on TV or in person?
That sounds like an unrealistically high number.
 
As for what Eddie would have done? Reality is, he lost the team and
owners today walk a thin line with telling what players do about
social issues.
 
To have the Orange Idiot weigh in on the protest and use it as another
wedge to further divide the people of this country is ridiculous.
 
People have short memories when it comes to social protest, the flag
and what was acceptable. Anyone have fond memories of the 60's and
70's when the country tore itself apart over Vietnam?
 
The brouhaha over protesting during the anthem is minor compared to
what happened in the past. The only person benefiting from all of this
is the fucking idiot in the White House.
"cao" <cao_black@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 07:43PM -0700

"John Walsh" wrote in message
news:tsj0tcld5e2qesv37gtuk6143tmvvtbohh@4ax.com...
 
On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 00:49:18 -0700, "Gary Rosen"
 
>"Interestingly, there's little difference of opinion on the protests and
>NFL viewing habits among whites, blacks and other minority adults," the
>poll said.
 
Is there a poll that says that 1/3 of the fans are less likely to
watch NFL games due to anthem protests? Watch on TV or in person?
That sounds like an unrealistically high number.
 
As for what Eddie would have done? Reality is, he lost the team and
owners today walk a thin line with telling what players do about
social issues.
 
To have the Orange Idiot weigh in on the protest and use it as another
wedge to further divide the people of this country is ridiculous.
 
People have short memories when it comes to social protest, the flag
and what was acceptable. Anyone have fond memories of the 60's and
70's when the country tore itself apart over Vietnam?
 
The brouhaha over protesting during the anthem is minor compared to
what happened in the past. The only person benefiting from all of this
is the fucking idiot in the White House.
 
******
 
So there you have it...should you be allowed to call the President a fucking
idiot on a public newsgroup? Is that what free speech means? I suppose I
have to defend you since I am an American and, although I disagree with you
I will defend until the death....ah, you know the rest. Oh wait...those
rules don't apply anymore because they were written by xenophobic white
racist slave owners. LIberals love to label, don't they.
 
Answer this...what would the reaction be to players performing some pregame
protest about abortion (because of their religious beliefs), or refusing to
wear the pink breast cancer ribbon (because it implies preferential
treatment to women)? Does lung cancer have a ribbon?
 
This crap has gone on long enough.
Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>: Sep 30 09:17PM -0600

On 9/30/2017 8:07 PM, poldy wrote:
> Sure the NFL could try to suppress that.  But it would stand apart from
> the NBA and other sports for suppressing speech.
 
Um, huh?!?!?!
 
 
https://nypost.com/2017/09/30/nba-players-must-stand-for-national-anthem/
 
NBA: Players must stand for national anthem
Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>: Sep 30 09:20PM -0600

On 9/30/2017 8:29 PM, John Walsh wrote:
>> poll said.
 
> Is there a poll that says that 1/3 of the fans are less likely to
> watch NFL games due to anthem protests?
 
Yes.
 
Watch on TV or in person?
 
Yes.
 
> That sounds like an unrealistically high number.
 
It's not.
 
> As for what Eddie would have done? Reality is, he lost the team and
> owners today walk a thin line with telling what players do about
> social issues.
 
Gutless ninnies!
 
> To have the Orange Idiot weigh in on the protest and use it as another
> wedge to further divide the people of this country is ridiculous.
 
WHo STARTED the disrespect of our National Anthem and flag?
 
Trump?
 
Or misguided young brainwashed men?
 
> People have short memories when it comes to social protest, the flag
> and what was acceptable. Anyone have fond memories of the 60's and
> 70's when the country tore itself apart over Vietnam?
 
Not fond, no.
 
> The brouhaha over protesting during the anthem is minor compared to
> what happened in the past.
 
No, it is NOT!
 
It is outright DISRESPECT of our veterans who have done NOTHING to
deserve such treatment!
 
> The only person benefiting from all of this
> is the fucking idiot in the White House.
 
YOU are a FUCKING IDIOT and a TRAITOR!
 
DIE YOU TREASONOUS BASTARD!
Nunya Bidnits <kc@burntup.ends>: Sep 30 09:21PM -0600

On 9/30/2017 8:43 PM, cao wrote:
> refusing to wear the pink breast cancer ribbon (because it implies
> preferential treatment to women)?  Does lung cancer have a ribbon?
 
> This crap has gone on long enough.
 
Indeed it has, and YOU sir are a PATRIOT!
 
Tall can Walsh belongs in a urinal eating breath mints.
"cao" <cao_black@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 09:29AM -0700

"John Walsh" wrote in message
news:549uscts621ueheps15b0u3utj1sldl5q9@4ax.com...
 
49ers at Cardinals
 
49ers: LB Reuben Foster, S Eric Reid OUT; RB Carlos Hyde, FB Kyle
Juszczyk, LB Brock Coyle, LB Pita Taumoepenu, S Jaquiski Tartt
QUESTIONABLE
 
Cardinals: G Mike Iupati, G Alex Boone, DL Robert Nkemdiche OUT; WR
John Brown, WR J.J. Nelson, OT D.J. Humphries QUESTIONABLE
 
Analysis: 49ers coach Kyle Shanahan said Friday that Hyde would be a
gametime decision for Sunday's matchup. If he can't go, Matt Breida
would likely be in for the lion's share of snaps at running back.
Cardinals coach Bruce Arians said Brown would return to action on
Sunday, though it remains to be seen how many snaps he'll get as he
works his way back from a quad injury.
 
Both Hyde and Brown were limited in practice all week. The Cardinals
have some serious issues on the line with Iupati sidelined for the
foreseeable future.
Raiders at Broncos
 
*****
 
l. What a shock, Hyde is injured. To be fair, the injured list so early
this season is astonishing.
2. To their credit, they did draft Willaims to carry some RB load (see #1
though).
3. They have a shot this week because Arizona OL is worse (see #1 again)
than the Niners. The offset to that is the Niners secondary, which is also
missing players (yep, see #1 yet again).
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Digest for alt.sports.basketball.nba.la-lakers@googlegroups.com - 3 updates in 2 topics

$Bill <news@todbe.com>: Sep 30 10:02PM -0700

Lakers with little practiced O, played so-so D, but fouled way too much and shot
crappy from 3 and FTs. Only 4 guys in DFs and no DD (played a lot of guys).
Kuzma picking up where he left off in Summer League with 19 pts in 26m. Fair
to Midland start for the Lakers - like to have seen a bit more. 99-108 Lakers
lose by 9.
 
Next games following:
DEN at LAL: Mon Oct 2 1930 Preseason Game 2 Staples Center
DEN at LAL: Wed Oct 4 1900 Preseason Game 3 Citizens Business Bank Arena
SAC at LAL: Sun Oct 8 1800 Preseason Game 4-Mobile Arena
 
#- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
 
Congrats to me the lone predictor.
 
MIN at LAL: Sat Sep 30 19:00:00 2017 (Run at: Sat Sep 30 21:44:03 2017)
 
NAME POST TIME LAL OPP DIFF VEC
 
Actual score: 99 108 -9
 
Qualified:
$Bill 30/18:54:42 96 104 -8 5.000
 
Average guess: 100.0 100.0 0.0 8.062
 
Disqualified:
 
Current prediction contest standings:
 
By vector avg: Usenet Vec
Predictor Tries Firsts Seconds Thirds DQs Score Avg Member
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
$Bill 1 1 0 0 0 5 5.000 yes
 
By Usenet 5:3:1 Scoring: Usenet Vec
Predictor Tries Firsts Seconds Thirds DQs Score Avg Member
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
$Bill 1 1 0 0 0 5 5.000 yes
 
Laker contest home: http://www.todbe.com/lakers/
YTD standings: http://www.todbe.com/lakers/cgi-bin/lakerytd.pl
HTML Schedule: http://www.todbe.com/lakers/cgi-bin/lakersched.pl?action=html
Cut-n-Paste Sched: http://www.todbe.com/lakers/cgi-bin/lakersched.pl?action=text
 
#- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
 
Quarterly Laker scoring leaders/notes (pluses OR/ST/BL; minuses TO/PF/oOR):
 
Q1 - Lakers a little slow starting, but get it going with the reserves -
shooting 48% vs 33%; pluses 4/2/3; minuses 2/9/6. Lakers need to hit the
boards and foul less. Ingram 9, Zubac 6, Kuzma 5, Randle 4. 29-31=-2Q.
 
Q2 - Laker shooting drops along with their D - shooting 37% vs 42%; pluses
4/2/1; minuses 6/8/4. Too many TOs - getting sloppy - still fouling.
Clarkson/Randle 5, Brewer 4. 24-30=-6Q.
 
HT - If LA can shoot and handle the ball more like Q1 than Q2, they've got a
chance - shooting 42% vs 38%; pluses 8/4/4; minuses 8/17/10.
Ingram/Randle 9, Zubac 8, Kuzma 7, Clarkson/Ball 5. 53-61=-8H.
 
Q3 - Lakers still not playing clean D - shooting 42% vs 43%; pluses 4/2/1;
minuses 4/7/2. Kuzma 8, Randle 6, Ennis 4. 21-25=-4Q (74-86=-12).
 
Q4 - Lakers only able to shave a couple pts off the deficit - shooting 53% vs
53%; pluses 1/4/1; minuses 4/5/2. Clarkson 7, Blue 5, Kuzma 4. 25-22=+3Q.
 
Game Dbl-figures Leaders:
Player Pts FG% 3P% FT% RB AS BL ST TO PF EFF
Kuzma 19 (75 /25 /0 )/ 5/ 0/ 0/ 1/ 0/ 2/+22
Randle 15 (50 /0 /50 )/ 7/ 1/ 1/ 0/ 2/ 1/+14
Clarkson 14 (60 /33 /100)/ 2/ 2/ 0/ 0/ 4/ 2/+10
Ingram 10 (27 /20 /50 )/ 6/ 1/ 0/ 0/ 1/ 4/ +4
 
Team scoring by Q (FG%/FG-AT includes 3P%/3P-AT):
Lakers Opponent Lakers Opponent
Q FG-AT 3P-AT FT-AT FG-AT 3P-AT FT-AT FG% 3P% FT% FG% 3P% FT% LAL OPP
1 12-25 3-10 2-2 9-27 3-4 10-14 48 30 100 33.3 75 71.4 29 31
2 10-27 1-11 3-4 11-26 1-6 7-7 37 9.1 75 42.3 16.7 100 24 30
H 22-52 4-21 5-6 20-53 4-10 17-21 42.3 19 83.3 37.7 40 81 53 61
3 10-24 0-4 1-2 9-21 2-7 5-8 41.7 0.0 50 42.9 28.6 62.5 21 25
A3 32-76 4-25 6-8 29-74 6-17 22-29 42.1 16 75 39.2 35.3 75.9 74 86
4 9-17 1-5 6-9 8-15 0-3 6-6 52.9 20 66.7 53.3 0.0 100 25 22
F 41-93 5-30 12-17 37-89 6-20 28-35 44.1 16.7 70.6 41.6 30 80 99 108
 
Team stats by Q (RB includes team RBs):
Lakers Opponent Diff
Q OR RB AS TO ST BL PF OR RB AS TO ST BL PF OR RB AS TO ST BL PF
1 4 14 9 2 2 3 9 6 14 7 2 1 0 4 -2 +2 +1 +3 +5
2 4 13 5 6 2 1 8 4 14 7 3 3 1 3 -1 -2 +3 -1 +5
H 8 27 14 8 4 4 17 10 28 14 5 4 1 7 -2 -1 +3 +3 +10
3 4 15 7 4 2 1 7 2 12 8 4 2 2 5 +2 +3 -1 -1 +2
A3 12 42 21 12 6 5 24 12 40 22 9 6 3 12 +2 -1 +3 +2 +12
4 1 44 6 4 4 1 5 2 -28 6 8 1 0 9 -1 +72 -4 +3 +1 -4
F 13 48 27 16 10 6 29 14 12 28 17 7 3 21 -1 +36 -1 -1 +3 +3 +8
 
#- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
 
NBA Box Score:
 
Team 1 2 3 4 Total
Minnesota Timberwolv 31 30 25 22 108
Los Angeles Lakers 31 21 22 25 99 - Final
 
PLAYER POS MIN FGM-A 3GM-A FTM-A OR TR AS TO ST BS PF PTS P36 +/- EFF
Andrew Wiggins SF 26:25 3-12 0-2 3-5 1 3 1 3 3 0 4 9 10 +13 +2
Taj Gibson PF 27:49 6-12 2-2 4-6 3 9 2 1 0 1 1 18 19 +1 +21
Karl-Anthony Tow C 20:59 4-9 3-3 4-4 0 6 3 0 0 2 0 15 21 +11 +21
Jimmy Butler SG 12:00 3-6 0-0 4-5 1 3 2 1 0 0 0 10 25 +0 +10
Jeff Teague PG 23:48 5-13 1-4 0-0 0 3 9 3 2 0 0 11 14 +12 +14
Gorgui Dieng C 27:01 7-12 0-0 0-0 4 12 0 2 0 0 2 14 16 -2 +19
Shabazz Muhammad F 29:38 7-12 0-2 8-10 3 6 0 1 1 0 1 22 22 -3 +21
Nemanja Bjelica F 20:11 1-5 0-3 1-1 2 4 3 1 1 0 4 3 4 +8 +6
Tyus Jones G 8:15 0-1 0-0 2-2 0 2 1 2 0 0 2 2 7 -2 +2
Jamal Crawford G 27:57 0-1 0-1 0-0 0 1 4 2 0 0 5 0 0 +8 +2
Aaron Brooks G 15:57 1-6 0-3 2-2 0 0 3 1 0 0 2 4 8 -1 +1
Cole Aldrich C 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Anthony Brown F 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Marcus Georges-H G 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Amile Jefferson F 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Justin Patton C 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Melo Trimble G 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Totals 0:00 37-89 6-20 28-35 14 49 28 17 7 3 21 108
Percent 41.6% 30.0% 80.0%
 
Biggest Lead: 20
Fastbreak Points: 10
Longest Run: 6
Points In Paint: 50
Points Off Turnovers: 24
Second Chance Points: 16
 
PLAYER POS MIN FGM-A 3GM-A FTM-A OR TR AS TO ST BS PF PTS P36 +/- EFF
Brandon Ingram SF 22:28 4-15 1-5 1-2 3 6 1 1 0 0 4 10 13 -10 +4
Larry Nance Jr. PF 25:15 1-7 0-1 1-2 4 9 1 1 0 1 4 3 4 -17 +6
Julius Randle C 21:47 7-14 0-2 1-2 1 7 1 2 0 1 1 15 21 -14 +14
Kentavious Caldw SG 18:35 1-7 0-4 2-2 1 3 1 1 2 0 2 4 6 -18 +3
Lonzo Ball PG 36:04 2-9 1-5 0-0 3 7 8 3 2 0 2 5 4 -13 +12
Jordan Clarkson G 22:44 6-10 1-3 1-1 0 2 2 4 0 0 2 14 18 +4 +10
Kyle Kuzma F 26:15 9-12 1-4 0-0 0 5 0 0 1 0 2 19 22 +4 +22
Corey Brewer G-F 15:33 2-3 0-1 2-2 0 1 0 1 4 1 3 6 12 -3 +10
Ivica Zubac C 19:19 4-6 0-1 1-2 0 5 2 1 0 2 5 9 14 +3 +14
Tyler Ennis G 11:56 3-5 0-1 0-0 0 0 8 2 1 0 2 6 15 +4 +11
Alex Caruso G 6:41 0-2 0-1 0-0 0 0 2 0 0 0 1 0 0 +5 +0
Vander Blue G 6:41 1-2 1-2 2-2 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 5 22 +5 +6
Thomas Bryant C 6:41 1-1 0-0 1-2 1 1 1 0 0 1 1 3 13 +5 +5
V.J. Beachem F 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Andrew Bogut C 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Luol Deng F 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Josh Hart G 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Brook Lopez C 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Briante Weber G 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Stephen Zimmerma C 0:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0 +0
Totals 0:00 41-93 5-30 12-17 13 48 27 16 10 6 29 99
Percent 44.1% 16.7% 70.6%
 
Biggest Lead: 2
Fastbreak Points: 13
Longest Run: 7
Points In Paint: 52
Points Off Turnovers: 17
Second Chance Points: 7
 
Times Tied: 0; Lead Changes: 0
Attendance: 0; Duration: 2:12
Officials: Gary Zielinski, Sean Wright, Randy Richardson
 
 
Yahoo Box Score:
 
Boxscore 1 2 3 4 Total
Minnesota Timberwolves 31 30 25 22 108
Los Angeles Lakers 31 21 22 25 99 - End of 4th Quarter
 
PLAYER POS MIN FGM-A 3GM-A FTM-A OR TR AS TO ST BS PF PTS P36 +/- EFF
Andrew Wiggins GF 26:25 3-12 0-2 3-5 1 3 1 3 3 0 4 9 10 +13 +2
Jimmy Butler GF 12:00 3-6 0-0 4-5 1 3 2 1 0 0 0 10 25 +0 +10
Taj Gibson FC 27:49 6-12 2-2 4-6 3 9 2 1 0 1 1 18 19 +1 +21
Jeff Teague PG 23:48 5-13 1-4 0-0 0 3 9 3 2 0 0 11 14 +12 +14
Karl-Anthony Tow C 20:59 4-9 3-3 4-4 0 6 3 0 0 2 0 15 21 +11 +21
Shabazz Muhammad GF 29:38 7-12 0-2 8-10 3 6 0 1 1 0 1 22 22 -3 +21
Jamal Crawford GF 27:57 0-1 0-1 0-0 0 1 4 2 0 0 5 0 0 +8 +2
Gorgui Dieng FC 27:01 7-12 0-0 0-0 4 12 0 2 0 0 2 14 16 -2 +19
Nemanja Bjelica PF 20:11 1-5 0-3 1-1 2 4 3 1 1 0 4 3 4 +8 +6
Aaron Brooks PG 15:57 1-6 0-3 2-2 0 0 3 1 0 0 2 4 8 -1 +1
Tyus Jones PG 8:15 0-1 0-0 2-2 0 2 1 2 0 0 2 2 7 -2 +2
Cole Aldrich C 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Anthony Brown SF 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Marcus Georges-H SG 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Amile Jefferson PF 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Justin Patton C 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Melo Trimble PG 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Totals 37-89 6-20 28-35 14 49 28 17 7 3 21 108
Percent 41.6 30.0 80.0
 
PLAYER POS MIN FGM-A 3GM-A FTM-A OR TR AS TO ST BS PF PTS P36 +/- EFF
Lonzo Ball PG 36:04 2-9 1-5 0-0 3 7 8 3 2 0 2 5 4 -13 +12
Kentavious Caldw SG 18:35 1-7 0-4 2-2 1 3 1 1 2 0 2 4 6 -18 +3
Brandon Ingram GF 22:28 4-15 1-5 1-2 3 6 1 1 0 0 4 10 13 -10 +4
Larry Nance Jr. PF 25:15 1-7 0-1 1-2 4 9 1 1 0 1 4 3 4 -17 +6
Julius Randle PF 21:47 7-14 0-2 1-2 1 7 1 2 0 1 1 15 21 -14 +14
Kyle Kuzma PF 26:15 9-12 1-4 0-0 0 5 0 0 1 0 2 19 22 +4 +22
Jordan Clarkson G 22:44 6-10 1-3 1-1 0 2 2 4 0 0 2 14 18 +4 +10
Ivica Zubac C 19:19 4-6 0-1 1-2 0 5 2 1 0 2 5 9 14 +3 +14
Corey Brewer GF 15:33 2-3 0-1 2-2 0 1 0 1 4 1 3 6 12 -3 +10
Tyler Ennis PG 11:56 3-5 0-1 0-0 0 0 8 2 1 0 2 6 15 +4 +11
Vander Blue PG 6:41 1-2 1-2 2-2 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 5 22 +5 +6
Thomas Bryant C 6:41 1-1 0-0 1-2 1 1 1 0 0 1 1 3 13 +5 +5
Alex Caruso SG 6:41 0-2 0-1 0-0 0 0 2 0 0 0 1 0 0 +5 +0
V.J. Beachem SF 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Andrew Bogut C 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Luol Deng F 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Josh Hart SG 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Brook Lopez C 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Briante Weber PG 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Stephen Zimmerma PF 00:00 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 +0
Totals 41-93 5-30 12-17 13 7 27 16 10 6 29 99
Percent 44.1 16.7 70.6
 
Stadium: Honda Center
Attendance: 18000
Refs: Gary Zielinski, Sean Wright, Randy Richardson
Duration 2:12
 
#- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
 
Recap from http://espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=400978678
 
Lonzo Ball scores five points, dishes out eight assists and grabs seven
rebounds in the Lakers' 108-99 loss to the Timberwolves.
 
In the fourth quarter, a number on Tyler Ennis' jersey is completely
ripped off. He's forced to put on another, throwing the damaged shirt
into the stands.
 
Larry Nance Jr. gets the bench on their feet with a massive one-handed
slam in the second half.
 
#- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
 
Game flow URL: http://www.popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20170930&game=MINLAL
From http://espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=400978678
 
1st Quarter
0-0 11:55 Karl-Anthony Towns vs. Larry Nance Jr. (Jimmy Butler gains possession)
0-0 11:40 Lonzo Ball shooting foul
0-0 11:40 Taj Gibson misses free throw 1 of 2
0-0 11:40 Timberwolves offensive team rebound
1-0 11:40 Taj Gibson makes free throw 2 of 2
1-2 11:40 Julius Randle makes layup
4-2 11:40 Jeff Teague makes 25-foot three point jumper (Taj Gibson assists)
4-2 11:40 Lonzo Ball misses 25-foot three point jumper
4-2 11:40 Taj Gibson defensive rebound
6-2 11:40 Jimmy Butler makes driving layup (Andrew Wiggins assists)
6-2 11:40 Julius Randle misses 26-foot three point jumper
6-2 11:40 Julius Randle offensive rebound
6-4 11:40 Julius Randle makes driving layup
6-4 10:26 Taj Gibson misses two point shot
6-4 10:24 Brandon Ingram defensive rebound
6-4 10:21 Brandon Ingram misses driving layup
6-4 10:16 Karl-Anthony Towns defensive rebound
6-4 10:14 Jeff Teague misses driving layup
6-4 10:11 Andrew Wiggins offensive rebound
6-4 10:10 Andrew Wiggins misses layup
6-4 10:08 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope defensive rebound
6-4 10:04 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope misses two point shot
6-4 10:00 Jimmy Butler defensive rebound
6-4 9:57 Jeff Teague misses 23-foot three point jumper
6-4 9:47 Julius Randle defensive rebound
6-4 9:44 Andrew Wiggins shooting foul
6-5 9:44 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope makes free throw 1 of 2
6-6 9:44 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope makes free throw 2 of 2
6-6 9:09 Jimmy Butler misses 15-foot jumper
6-6 9:05 Lonzo Ball defensive rebound
6-6 8:59 Brandon Ingram misses 14-foot two point shot
6-6 8:52 Larry Nance Jr. offensive rebound
6-6 8:52 Larry Nance Jr. misses tip shot
6-6 8:51 Lonzo Ball offensive rebound
6-8 8:49 Brandon Ingram makes 21-foot jumper (Lonzo Ball assists)
6-8 8:37 Karl-Anthony Towns misses 17-foot two point shot
6-8 8:32 Julius Randle defensive rebound
6-8 8:17 Andrew Wiggins misses driving layup
6-8 8:16 Lakers Full timeout
6-8 8:15 Andrew Wiggins personal foul
6-8 8:13 Taj Gibson offensive rebound
6-8 8:13 Taj Gibson misses tip shot
$Bill <news@todbe.com>: Sep 30 06:24PM -0700

104 96 # wish they had a big playing this one
$Bill <news@todbe.com>: Sep 30 06:54PM -0700

On 09-30-17 18:24, $Bill wrote:
 
> 104  96   # wish they had a big playing this one
 
96 104 # reverse that
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Digest for alt.sports.hockey.nhl.mtl-canadiens@googlegroups.com - 5 updates in 1 topic

Jim Bauch <j.bauch@ca.rr.com>: Sep 30 01:08PM -0700

All I can think of is: no major injuries, and I guess Victor Mete has impressed enough that he might get a 10-game tryout. Oh, and maybe Hudon.
 
But otherwise, with Scherbak and McCarron being sent down, Carr put on waivers... doesn't look like any help is on the way. It's last year's squad, minus Radulov and Markov, plus some bargain basement acquisitions.
 
Jim
gorgofromns@gmail.com: Sep 30 04:05PM -0700

Well... there is Drouin.
Jim Bauch <j.bauch@ca.rr.com>: Sep 30 04:49PM -0700

> Well... there is Drouin.
 
Oh, right. Fair enough, I had forgotten him.
 
Jim
Gerry <gerry14@hotmail.com>: Sep 30 07:38PM -0700

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 7:49:08 PM UTC-4, Jim Bauch wrote:
> On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 4:05:33 PM UTC-7, gorgo...@gmail.com wrote:
> > Well... there is Drouin.
 
> Oh, right. Fair enough, I had forgotten him.
 
Although in a way, he's almost like addition with double subtraction. They don't have the future D glorious hope in Sergachev, and they seem to have an even larger excuse to marginalize Galchenyuk.
 
l8r,
Gerry
Gerry <gerry14@hotmail.com>: Sep 30 07:41PM -0700

Wait, 9-2... am I reading that a-right? Ok, there has to be positives therein. I didn't think this team could ever score 9 goals, in any format.
 
l8r,
Gerry
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Digest for rec.sport.tennis@googlegroups.com - 25 updates in 6 topics

bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:55PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 10:17:22 -0700 (PDT), Gracchus
>> defeat.
 
>> go bernie!
 
>They cut off their their nose to spite their face because they never understood that it was never about Bernie Sanders. Bernie resonated with millions of disenfranchised Democrats and Independents sick to death of what the party had become and the candidates it was (pre)selecting. So instead of being inclusive at the convention, the Clintons/DNC kept treating any non-Clintonite as an unneeded adversary. After all, they had the luxury of rejecting the "disloyal" because there would be more than enough votes to ensure election without these impudent upstarts--so they thought anyway.
 
they were positive of the win and figured as soon as they won, bernie
would be the man on the outside.
 
but it wasn't bernie found wandering in the woods aimlessly by some
poor couple walking their dog.
 
>Anyway, I'm feeling bad that this thread is turning into a political one. That's disrespectful to Leo.
 
leo just doesn't cary the weight he used to. :-)
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:58PM -0400

>DNC/Hillary...
 
>So not only were these die hard Bernie supporters childish but they were
>also pulled by the strings of Kremlin. What a bunch of damn morons.
 
i feel bad for you just listen to yourself. seriously. YOU yourself
are blaming bernie just like hillary's book! ahahahaha. i love this.
 
i believe it was a dem leaking it themselves, but even if putin hacked
the DNC machine, it revealed a pro clinton anti bernie conspiracy in
what was supposed to be a fair and neutral organization.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:59PM -0400

>>> Trash can
 
>> :)
 
>...I can feel your pain. Thank god he's not my president.
 
ah, but he is. :-)
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:00PM -0400

>>> DNC/Hillary...
 
>> You mean the hacks that exposed the DNC's corruption? The hilarious part there is that the Russians didn't need to fabricate anything. Their great evil was revealing the truth.
 
>But only from one side.
 
maybe they couldn't find anything on bernie.
 
>You think there wasn't MUCH bigger skeletons in RNC/Trump's closet which
>Russia knew about...
 
we'll find out in the next 3 yrs won't we. as of now, FBI has nothing.
russia's not saying anything. but TT suffers.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:04PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 10:53:34 -0700 (PDT), Court_1
 
>It may be good for me economically but I can't stand Trump's character. Never could and never will. I can't stand Mike Pence either for other reasons.
 
>As for Silverman, she did nothing wrong. She was a Sanders supporter and when she knew Sanders definitely had no chance she went with Clinton and told the Bernie or bust supporters they were being ridiculous with their continued Bernie fervor. It's not her fault many of the US citizens were ignoramuses who believed Trump would come to their rescue. He doesn't give two shits about working class people.
 
>If anybody dares to criticize Bernie or his supporters, you become deranged.
 
and yet you don't see how deranged you get when anyone criticized
hillary.
 
fwiw, i haven't heard jack about hillary for the last 4-5 months.
republicans and independents don't waste their time on her anymore.
even bernie chuckled and played off hillary on colbert last wk.
 
welcome to the world of irrelevancy Mrs Clinton.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:12PM -0400

>know who to vote!". Putin waves the man goodbye, smiling, holding in his
>other hand a picture of the other candidate raping a groundhog.
 
>The man gives his vote to a groundhog rapist.
 
fact: the man was caught peeing.
fiction: the man raped a groundhog.
 
bob
Gracchus <gracchado@gmail.com>: Sep 30 06:19PM -0700

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 6:04:14 PM UTC-7, bob wrote:
 
> republicans and independents don't waste their time on her anymore.
> even bernie chuckled and played off hillary on colbert last wk.
 
> welcome to the world of irrelevancy Mrs Clinton.
 
Remember those copy & pastes of Hillary's resume we used to see here all the time? Who can ever forget that glowing C.V. proving beyond any doubt that she was the most qualified candidate ever? But I doubt if we'll be seeing that again without dipping into the RST archives. C1 tossed Hillary under the bus like a dirty rag doll on election night.
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:35PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 18:19:44 -0700 (PDT), Gracchus
 
>> welcome to the world of irrelevancy Mrs Clinton.
 
>Remember those copy & pastes of Hillary's resume we used to see here all the time? Who can ever forget that glowing C.V. proving beyond any doubt that she was the most qualified candidate ever?
>But I doubt if we'll be seeing that again without dipping into the RST archives. C1 tossed Hillary under the bus like a dirty rag doll on election night.
 
who could ever forget hillary having "the better resume." lol. too bad
she didn't get the job.
 
bob
Court_1 <olympia0000@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 07:41PM -0700

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 4:08:32 PM UTC-4, Gracchus wrote:
 
> Anyone at odds with your politics automatically is crazy.
 
If that's not a pot calling the kettle black comment, I don't know what is. Everybody on RST has displayed his/her passion when it comes to political views and you're no exception. I've actually been quite silent on most of the political threads in the past six months. I try to stay out of them as I know little good can come out of these circular arguments. One can't say the same for you. You keep ranting away about all of the injustices done to Bernie and his ilk. Boo hoo.

>You don't seem to notice this pattern somehow. Sarandon, Richard Gere, etc.
 
I don't think I said anything about Gere's politics did I? but he's got some odd views as well.
 
>I don't agree with Sarandon on everything myself, such as her anti-death penalty stance.
 
That's the one point I actually agree with her about. ;)
 
> But it doesn't matter because she's true to her principles instead of going this way and that depending on the political climate or others' reactions. IMO that alone is something worthy of respect.
 
In order to be worthy of respect, you have to respect the content of what she's expressing. I don't. I think she comes off as flighty.

> Your "move on" comment is ironic considering what those candidates are doing now. What's the name of Hillary's book--"Look What Happened to Poor Little Me"?
 
That's true about Hillary but I was specifically talking about Bernie's "supporters" and not Bernie himself or Hillary herself. The Bernie supporters couldn't move on when it was long past the time for them to do so and Sarah Silverman brought that point to light. There's nothing wrong with what Silverman said. She hit the nail on the head IMO.
Court_1 <olympia0000@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 07:43PM -0700

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 4:46:15 PM UTC-4, grif wrote:
 
> Spoorloos (confined spaces are not my thing)
 
That's a great one and I agree!
 
> The Wailing (supernatural wtfuckery)?
 
So you watched it? Yould you recommend it?
Court_1 <olympia0000@yahoo.com>: Sep 30 07:45PM -0700

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 4:58:44 PM UTC-4, TT wrote:
> ...One of the best musicals ever. Decorated at the time but strangely
> forgotten recently.
 
> Elvira Madigan, Letter Never Sent etc...
 
Interesting suggestions. I haven't heard about most of them.
 
A couple of obscure suggestions I have:
 
The Maze
Whisper <beaver999@ozemail>: Oct 01 11:43AM +1100

On 1/10/2017 4:54 AM, PeteWasLucky wrote:
 
> Your master has been saying for years that winning Wimbledon tops any other achievement, right?
 
> What about a second slam in addition to the 8th wimbledon?
 
Yes, Fed pips it in terms of slams won -but just barely.
 
If we consider other achievements;
 
blue chip slams won
slam r/up
yr-end no.1
 
Then I guess Rafa pips Fed overall.
 
 
 
 
 
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Whisper <beaver999@ozemail>: Oct 01 11:46AM +1100

On 1/10/2017 5:24 AM, MBDunc wrote:
 
> IMO FO + USO very slightly ahead Wimb + AO, but it is practically toss up.
 
> Let YEC decide.
 
> .mikko
 
FO/USO are 2 blue chip slams so that's a defensible position. YEC could
be interesting especially if it's Fed v Rafa in final. Rafa has yr-end
no.1 & 3 slam finals over Fed - if he also wins YEC then there will be
no arguments?
 
:)
 
 
 
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bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:09PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 17:40:12 -0700 (PDT), PeteWasLucky
 
>> led 3-1 in 5th
 
>Oh true, we forgot this, lol :)
 
>Let me say it straight, winning the 8th wimbledon is the ultimate achievement, nothing tops this, absolutely.
 
i'm sad i have to agree on 2 counts.
1. it was federer's personal dream.
2. he's the wimbledon king now.
 
it was huge. shame nobody did crap at wimbledon. but for the overall
year, rafa's right there with him - his USO was a big non clay slam
for him too.
 
>I wish Dave was around, he would have been very happy, he would have said, Federer is the champion of The Championships.
 
 
bob
PeteWasLucky <waleed.khedr@gmail.com>: Sep 30 06:11PM -0700

> i'm sad i have to agree on 2 counts.
 
Why are you sad?
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:14PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 18:11:40 -0700 (PDT), PeteWasLucky
 
>> i'm sad i have to agree on 2 counts.
 
>Why are you sad?
 
because i wanted sampras to have the wimbledon record and rafa to have
the slam record. fed's going to have, and keep, them both.
 
bob
PeteWasLucky <waleed.khedr@gmail.com>: Sep 30 06:22PM -0700

> because i wanted sampras to have the wimbledon record and rafa to have
the slam record. fed's going to have, and keep, them both.
 
I understand the Sampras case, but the Rafa's case, is this because you like Rafa or because you hate Federer?
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:29PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 18:22:45 -0700 (PDT), PeteWasLucky
 
>> because i wanted sampras to have the wimbledon record and rafa to have
>the slam record. fed's going to have, and keep, them both.
 
>I understand the Sampras case, but the Rafa's case, is this because you like Rafa or because you hate Federer?
 
i don't hate federer, surely there are other athletes i dislike far
more. i like rafa better. but hey, fed brought the goods this year.
IMO it was fortunate that djok and murray laid an egg, but that's part
of the game.
 
bob
PeteWasLucky <waleed.khedr@gmail.com>: Sep 30 07:39PM -0700

> i don't hate federer, surely there are other athletes i dislike far
more. i like rafa better. but hey, fed brought the goods this year.
IMO it was fortunate that djok and murray laid an egg, but that's part
of the game.
 
These great athletes kept me motivated to stay in shape, to be fit just to be able to play tennis.
 
I love playing tennis more than anything in my life. My love for tennis is a big problem and it causes lots of problems in my personal relationships.
 
Boris Becker got me to start playing tennis, to run miles and miles, Lendl as well, then sampras for many years, and then thanks God for having Federer, this is when I decided to play effortless tennis, study his mechanics and swings, enjoyed his tennis and played similar tennis for 15 years.
 
It's been a blessing (for me :) ) to witness him and witness his game and career.
 
He will be missed greatly (for me again).
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:07PM -0400


>> And with that, the mayor of a ruined city merited a mention in Trump's Twitter feed.
 
>> "The Mayor of San Juan, who was very complimentary only a few days ago, has now been told by the Democrats that you must be nasty to Trump," he wrote.
 
>This mayor, is he a leftist?
 
duh.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 09:13PM -0400


>> And with that, the mayor of a ruined city merited a mention in Trump's Twitter feed.
 
>> "The Mayor of San Juan, who was very complimentary only a few days ago, has now been told by the Democrats that you must be nasty to Trump," he wrote.
 
>This mayor, is he a leftist?
 
... she btw.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:52PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 11:13:53 -0700 (PDT), Court_1
>> trump has been a different thing from the normal good natured jabs at
>> previous presidents.
 
>That's because Trump is a psychopath and no normal individuals take him seriously except for the disenfranchised fools who thought he would come to their rescue.
 
you're on record saying trump's policies may be good for you and your
family. i never once said trump would do anything good for me.
 
i thought he might do some harm to the swamp, and it might have a good
effect on the country as a whole. at the very least he ran the bushes
and clintons out of washington with their tails between their legs.
that was worth admission.
 
>> heartfelt appeal to the population to not let that monster get away
>> with it. gone beyond normal comedy.
 
>His baby son has a heart condition, had to have heart surgery and hence the healthcare speech. STFU you heartless buffoon! Have some empathy for his situation.
 
i have empahty for his little baby, not kimmel. when kimmel, a
multimillionaire with the very best L.A. doctors at his disposal had a
need for a pediatric heart doctor, he took that opportunity to blast
trump about healthcare? why not before then?
 
it's TV of the lowest order. classless.

>> but as long as it's just talk, and nothing bad has
>> actually happened, i can't judge him harshly so far.
 
>That's how you're rationalizing Trump's behavior now? You're a joke.
 
bless your heart.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:47PM -0400

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 21:47:01 +0300, Pelle Svanslös <pelle@svans.los>
wrote:
 
 
>For starters, Obama would have had to have a 60 in the Senate. He had
>one for a few months in 2009 but not after that. I'm not sure even the
>Democrats are ready for single payer.
 
finally you admitted it.
 
> You seem to be though.
 
single payer would be fine with me.
 
 
>> no, obama changed the laws and rules. so it's new.
 
>What is underlying, the insurance model, is and was screwed long before
>ACA. If/when ObamaCare is dismantled, it will still be screwed.
 
because like i said, until you address the costs obamacare is screwed,
any new similar republican plan is screwed. the "old " method may also
be screwed. but single payer, and the gov't regulating costs, may be
sustainable.
 
 
>> afraid, or unable, call it what you will. it didn't address the
>> problem.
 
>"Addressing" the probklem is a big undertaking.
 
of course. it's huge. but if you refuse to address it, just tell your
constitutents you're not going to address it, and live with it.
 
> Sometimes in politics you take baby steps. You can view ACA as one.
 
my problem with obamacare is all it did was grossly expand medicaid
while asking the middle class to pick up the bill.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:47PM -0400

>> "Addressing" the probklem is a big undertaking. Sometimes in politics
>> you take baby steps. You can view ACA as one.
 
>Bob should know about Baby Steps.
 
i didn't cry after the election.
 
bob
bob <bob@nospam.net>: Sep 30 08:42PM -0400


>Yeah, I'm sure Russia is your friend really.
 
>The worst conclusion one can make from these 'revelations' is that
>Department of Homeland Security may not be very reliable/competent.
 
that's not the conclusion i drew.
 
bob
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Digest for rec.sport.golf@googlegroups.com - 25 updates in 4 topics

"DumbedDownUSA" <dumb.america@gmail.com>: Sep 30 10:52AM

Alan Baker wrote:
 
> > > > > belongs to Antifa. Why say so?
 
> > > > > > Portland May Day protester pleads guilty after throwing
> > > > > > flare into cop car
 
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/28/portland-may-day-protester-pleads-guilty-after-throwing-flare-into-cop-car
 
> > > > Another sweetheart was given probation...
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/09/arsonist_in_portland_may_day_p.html#incart_most-read_
 
> > > > Here is the original story. Note the references to "black clad
> > > > protesters" It speaks of organization, BK.
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/05/portland_may_day_demonstration.html
 
> No... ...I'm sorry but it doesn't follow that because a person
> decided to dress in a particular way then he or she must
> automatically be part of a group that dresses in a similar fashion.
 
So you pretend not to see the dots.
 
--
Trump ***Irresponsible, unprofessional and sending the wrong message.***
"Jim Dandy" <jandy@gmail.com>: Sep 30 09:47AM -0400

"DumbedDownUSA" wrote in message
news:xn0kvl5l52by2o2004@news.eternal-september.org...
 
Alan Baker wrote:
 
> > > > > belongs to Antifa. Why say so?
 
> > > > > > Portland May Day protester pleads guilty after throwing
> > > > > > flare into cop car
 
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/28/portland-may-day-protester-pleads-guilty-after-throwing-flare-into-cop-car
 
> > > > Another sweetheart was given probation...
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/09/arsonist_in_portland_may_day_p.html#incart_most-read_
 
> > > > Here is the original story. Note the references to "black clad
> > > > protesters" It speaks of organization, BK.
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/05/portland_may_day_demonstration.html
> decided to dress in a particular way then he or she must
> automatically be part of a group that dresses in a similar fashion.
 
>So you pretend not to see the dots.
 
 
ANYTHING for attention.
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: Sep 30 07:22AM -0700

On 2017-09-30 3:52 AM, DumbedDownUSA wrote:
>> decided to dress in a particular way then he or she must
>> automatically be part of a group that dresses in a similar fashion.
 
> So you pretend not to see the dots.
 
Nope.
 
I correctly see that mere similarity in clothing doesn't mean anything.
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: Sep 30 08:48AM -0700

> No... ...I'm sorry but it doesn't follow that because a person
> decided to dress in a particular way then he or she must
> automatically be part of a group that dresses in a similar fashion.
 
So you pretend not to see the dots.
- show quoted text -
 
That's what this resident asshole troll (RAT) does. Argue the obvious only to initiate and perpetuate an argument. The obvious is that a group of black clad idiots showed up and turned a peaceful protest into a riot. Baker thinks this was random. Punks who just happened to be wearing black swarming together.
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 12:00PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 10:52:20 -0000 (UTC), "DumbedDownUSA"
>> decided to dress in a particular way then he or she must
>> automatically be part of a group that dresses in a similar fashion.
 
>So you pretend not to see the dots.
 
You misread Alan's post.
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 12:05PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 08:48:16 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>
wrote:
 
 
>So you pretend not to see the dots.
>- show quoted text -
 
>That's what this resident asshole troll (RAT) does. Argue the obvious only to initiate and perpetuate an argument. The obvious is that a group of black clad idiots showed up and turned a peaceful protest into a riot. Baker thinks this was random. Punks who just happened to be wearing black swarming together.
 
But what he says is true, and a fact.
"DumbedDownUSA" <dumb.america@gmail.com>: Sep 30 05:05PM

> he >> > > > > belongs to Antifa. Why say so?
 
> >> > > > > > Portland May Day protester pleads guilty after throwing
> >> > > > > > flare into cop car
 
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/28/portland-may-day-protester-pleads-guilty-after-throwing-flare-into-cop-car
 
> >> > > > Another sweetheart was given probation...
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/09/arsonist_in_portland_may_day_p.html#incart_most-read_
 
> >> > > > Here is the original story. Note the references to "black
> clad >> > > > protesters" It speaks of organization, BK.
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/05/portland_may_day_demonstration.html
> >> automatically be part of a group that dresses in a similar fashion.
 
> > So you pretend not to see the dots.
 
> You misread Alan's post.
 
What makes you think so?
 
--
Trump ***Irresponsible, unprofessional and sending the wrong message.***
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 12:08PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 17:05:04 -0000 (UTC), "DumbedDownUSA"
 
>> > So you pretend not to see the dots.
 
>> You misread Alan's post.
 
>What makes you think so?
 
Did you think that was written by Greg? It's refuting him. Read it
again.
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: Sep 30 12:55PM -0700

>> - show quoted text -
 
>> That's what this resident asshole troll (RAT) does. Argue the obvious only to initiate and perpetuate an argument. The obvious is that a group of black clad idiots showed up and turned a peaceful protest into a riot. Baker thinks this was random. Punks who just happened to be wearing black swarming together.
 
> But what he says is true, and a fact.
 
Thank you, Bobby.
 
For those who are somewhat thoughtful, it should have been obvious.
 
:-)
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 04:34PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 12:55:07 -0700, Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>
wrote:
 
 
>> But what he says is true, and a fact.
 
>Thank you, Bobby.
 
>For those who are somewhat thoughtful, it should have been obvious.
 
We all overlook a fact at times that disputes our opinion because we
want to be correct.
"DumbedDownUSA" <dumb.america@gmail.com>: Sep 30 09:53PM

> that >> he >> > > > > belongs to Antifa. Why say so?
 
> >> >> > > > > > Portland May Day protester pleads guilty after
> throwing >> >> > > > > > flare into cop car
 
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/28/portland-may-day-protester-pleads-guilty-after-throwing-flare-into-cop-car
 
> >> >> > > > Another sweetheart was given probation...
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/09/arsonist_in_portland_may_day_p.html#incart_most-read_
 
> >> >> > > > Here is the original story. Note the references to "black
> >> clad >> > > > protesters" It speaks of organization, BK.
 
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/05/portland_may_day_demonstration.html
 
> > What makes you think so?
 
> Did you think that was written by Greg? It's refuting him. Read it
> again.
 
I read what Alan said. It's simply ignorant.
 
What's your take on this guy. Do you have a point other than "Greg is
wrong because, well he's Greg and we don't like what he has to say".
 
This guy clearly affiliated himself with antifa and went on the
rampage. He didn't just happen to be wondering down the street in black
pyjamas with a couple of flares in his pocket and happened upon the
protest.
 
I bet you weren't asking to James Fields alt-right membership card
before you accepted he wasn't a passerby who lost control of his car.
 
--
Trump ***Irresponsible, unprofessional and sending the wrong message.***
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 06:35PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 21:53:08 -0000 (UTC), "DumbedDownUSA"
 
>I read what Alan said. It's simply ignorant.
 
You didn't see my earlier post where I agreed with Greg I guess.
 
But...Alan's post was correct in that it's impossible to know that
someone's clothes are proof of being a member of a group that dresses
the same.
 
>What's your take on this guy. Do you have a point other than "Greg is
>wrong because, well he's Greg and we don't like what he has to say".
 
No. Greg is a friend. We've known each other for over twenty years.
We agree on some things and disagree on others. The latter has been
more prevalent since Trump.
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: Sep 30 05:54PM -0700

This guy clearly affiliated himself with antifa and went on the
rampage. He didn't just happen to be wondering down the street in black
pyjamas with a couple of flares in his pocket and happened upon the
protest.
 
Same is true with the others who got arrested too.
 
I bet you weren't asking to James Fields alt-right membership card
before you accepted he wasn't a passerby who lost control of his car.
 
Bingo!
 
- show quoted text -
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: Sep 30 05:59PM -0700

>I read what Alan said. It's simply ignorant.
 
You didn't see my earlier post where I agreed with Greg I guess.
 
I certainly read it, which surprises me that you seem to agree with the RAT's latest troll bait.
 
But...Alan's post was correct in that it's impossible to know that
someone's clothes are proof of being a member of a group that dresses
the same.
 
It's not coincidence. They showed up together after the May Day protest began. They have only one thing on their mind. Anarchy and destruction.
 
>What's your take on this guy. Do you have a point other than "Greg is
>wrong because, well he's Greg and we don't like what he has to say".
 
No. Greg is a friend. We've known each other for over twenty years.
We agree on some things and disagree on others. The latter has been
more prevalent since Trump.
 
On this we fully agree! :-)
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 08:28PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 17:59:35 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>
wrote:
 
>someone's clothes are proof of being a member of a group that dresses
>the same.
 
>It's not coincidence. They showed up together after the May Day protest began. They have only one thing on their mind. Anarchy and destruction.
 
They? He may not be a part of them. He could just be a delinquent
thug. What he did was burn a cop car. I didn't read where he
attacked any individuals.
 
So, you may be correct, but it is still not a provable situation.
That's where we disagree, the COULD have been sitting at home, seen
the action on TV and decided to dress in black and get in on it. You
cannot say that this isn't a possibility.
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: Sep 30 07:44PM -0700

They? He may not be a part of them. He could just be a delinquent
thug. What he did was burn a cop car. I didn't read where he
attacked any individuals.
 
So, you may be correct, but it is still not a provable situation.
That's where we disagree, the COULD have been sitting at home, seen
the action on TV and decided to dress in black and get in on it. You
cannot say that this isn't a possibility.
- show quoted text -
 
Possible...but unlikely. I'm just amazed they are actually prosecuting these thugs. We are talking Portland you know.
"DumbedDownUSA" <dumb.america@gmail.com>: Sep 30 11:15AM

The emphassis is on unbelievable.
 
'It's not good for me. Believe me' said Trump
 
Can you believe him? That phrase usually sends up alarm bells for me
when he uses it.
 
Analysis suggests most people will see modest tax reduction of about 1%
but for the top 1% (Trumps club) it's nearer 8%. How ill this not
benefit Trump?
 
Trump wants to cut AMT. AMT was the reason Trump had to pay $31m in
taxes in 2005 he won't have to worry about that any more if he gets his
way.
 
This is before we even get into the pass through tax and lower
corporation tax.
 
Then we have the cost and who pays. The cost, between $3tn and $7tn
over the next decade. Add that to the national debt and have your
kids... and their kids to pay for it for the rest of their lives and/or
offset it against the cuts in healthcare, schools, social security and
disabilty insurance.
 
Trumps kids should be able to afford their share though... from the
estate taxes they won't have to pay when the unbelievable president
farts his last.
 
So which Trumpets believe Trump this time?
 
--
Trump ***Irresponsible, unprofessional and sending the wrong message.***
"Jim Dandy" <jandy@gmail.com>: Sep 30 09:40AM -0400

>kids... and their kids to pay for it for the rest of their lives and/or
>offset it against the cuts in healthcare, schools, social security and
>disabilty insurance.
 
Trumps kids should be able to afford their share though... from the
estate taxes they won't have to pay when the unbelievable president
farts his last.
 
 
 
 
MORE FAKE NEWS FORM THE FAR LEFT.
 
 
You should research before defecating. Which would give you nothing to lie
about.
"DumbedDownUSA" <dumb.america@gmail.com>: Sep 30 05:02PM

Jim Dandy wrote:
 
> MORE FAKE NEWS FORM THE FAR LEFT.
 
> You should research before defecating. Which would give you nothing
> to lie about.
 
Your mum defactated while giving birth, that's why you have shit for
brains and have not one word worth reading.
 
Plonk (as always)
 
--
Trump ***Irresponsible, unprofessional and sending the wrong message.***
"John B." <johnb505@gmail.com>: Sep 30 10:08AM -0700

On Saturday, September 30, 2017 at 7:15:22 AM UTC-4, DumbedDownUSA wrote:
 
> So which Trumpets believe Trump this time?
 
> --
> Trump ***Irresponsible, unprofessional and sending the wrong message.***
 
Why Trump or anyone else with his net worth should get yet
another tax cut is beyond me.
Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>: Sep 30 06:07PM -0700

- show quoted text -
Why Trump or anyone else with his net worth should get yet
another tax cut is beyond me.
 
$.40 on the dollar is steep. Add another 9 to 10% for state income tax and one is up to $.50 on the dollar. That's ridiculous. What are we...Canada?
 
I see no problem with dropping the top rate to 35% and eliminating loopholes. I am definitely for eliminating the death tax. How can it be fair to tax somebody twice?
BK@Onramp.net: Sep 30 08:36PM -0500

On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 18:07:39 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gdstrue@aol.com>
wrote:
 
>another tax cut is beyond me.
 
>$.40 on the dollar is steep. Add another 9 to 10% for state income tax and one is up to $.50 on the dollar. That's ridiculous. What are we...Canada?
 
>I see no problem with dropping the top rate to 35% and eliminating loopholes.
 
If ....they eliminate them.
 
>I am definitely for eliminating the death tax. How can it be fair to tax somebody twice?
 
No argument there. The gift tax is a little weird too.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com>: Sep 30 07:22PM -0700

Bobby wrote
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2017 18:07:39 -0700 (PDT), Dene <gds...@aol.com>
wrote:
>>>Why Trump or anyone else with his net worth should get yet
>>>another tax cut is beyond me.
 
>>$.40 on the dollar is steep.
 
Historically, it isn't; US rates used to be much higher.
 
>> Add another 9 to 10% for state income tax and one is
>> up to $.50 on the dollar.
 
Only if you forget it's been a deduction on Schedule A.
 
>> That's ridiculous. What are we...Canada?
 
>>I see no problem with dropping the top rate to 35% and eliminating loopholes.
 
> If ....they eliminate them.
 
If they *permanently* do so...but that was the objective of the
AMT, which is proposed to be killed.
 
>>I am definitely for eliminating the death tax. How can it be fair
>>to tax somebody twice?
 
>No argument there.
 
The tax for most Estates is zero ... it's predominantly the sub-1%'ers - and
then only those that didn't plan ahead.
 
Plus most survivors get a free bump up in Cost Basis, which is a huge tax
loophole on the first $5 million (again, the vast majority of Estates).
 
>The gift tax is a little weird too.
 
Probably to minimize people trying to circumvent the Estste / Inheritance
taxes, particularly as some of those get weird in some States by having
different taxation rates depending on the relationship to the deceased.
 
-hh
Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com>: Oct 01 12:33AM +0200

Amazing what name comes to mind.
 
Yea, you win asshole!
 
Post away! OT OT OT OT OT OT
 
Your father knew what trash you were!
 
And still are.
 
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>: Sep 30 07:37AM -0700

......but take responsibility:
 
'Donald Trump has lashed out at Puerto Rico politicians over their
criticism of US relief efforts on the island following Hurricane Maria.
The category four hurricane a week ago killed 16 people on the island
and left millions in need of aid.
 
In a series of tweets, Trump said that Puerto Rican officials showed
"poor leadership ability" and "want everything to be done for them".
It comes after the Mayor of San Juan made a desperate plea for federal help.
 
"We have no time for patience any more," said Carmen Yulin Cruz in a
news conference.
 
"I am asking the president of the United States to make sure somebody is
in charge that is up to the task of saving lives.
 
"I am done being polite. I am done being politically correct. I am mad
as hell."'
 
<http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41452995>
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